Stribede Legender: Mogens Therkildsen – 2. del
Vi har snakket med vores tidligere målmand, Mogens Therkildsen, i vores nye tiltag ‘Stribede Legender’. 2. og sidste del af snakken handler mest om mesterskabet i 1977 og Lars Høgh.
Du gør comeback med seks kampe i OB i mesterskabssæsonen 1977. Hvad er historien bag det?
– Der sker det, at Preben Hjort ringer til mig, mens jeg sidder nede i Tyskland. Han siger, at Erik Berthelsen har brækket benet, og hvis jeg mener, jeg kan hjælpe, så skal jeg ringe til Richard. Jeg ringer så til Richard, og han siger, det var pænt af mig, men han vil lige prøve knægten (Lars Høgh). Om aftenen kan jeg så se, at OB har vundet i Århus med 4-1, og jeg ringer så til Richard, fordi jeg tror, alt så er i orden, men Richard siger, ‘Nej nej, han er for tynd, og han har for små hænder’, men han ville så lige prøve en, der hed Per Henriksen i den næste kamp mod Køge. Den blev spillet i Odense, og det var en ‘lyskamp’. OB vandt 3-2, så jeg ringede igen til Richard, og troede, han nu havde fundet hans målmand, men så sagde Richard, ‘Nej for satan, han bruger briller, han kan ikke se noget i lyset, og han droppede to mål, nu må du komme hjem’.
– Jeg kom så om fredagen, da skolen var færdig, og så trænede jeg med holdet. Søndag spillede vi så herude mod KB, og vi spillede en af de bedste kampe, jeg nogensinde havde set. Ole Qvist havde desværre bare en af sine gode dage i deres mål. Finn Laudrup og Niels Christian Holmstrøm var med for dem, men vi kørte dem ud af banen. Jeg lavede ingenting, og jeg ville gerne have betalt for at se kampen. Vi spillede så flot, men kampen endte så 0-0. Jeg tror, det var i den kamp, Flemming Nielsen brækkede næsen. Holmstrøm trådte på ham, mens han lå ned. Det var sgu ikke smart, han var lidt af en bisseknægt.
– Derfra har vi 14 dages pause inden kampen mod B1909, og det er meget godt, for så kan jeg lige nå at få trænet lidt og snakket med spillerne. Richard gjorde det hver tirsdag, at han kørte til Schleswig, og trænede med mig. Dengang var der ikke motorvej hele vejen. Han kom hver tirsdag, og så lånte vi en bane lige nede foran skolen, hvor jeg boede, og ham der passede banen, gav vi 10 mark for det, så var det sgu i orden. Det gjorde Richard seks gange. Det er fandme utroligt. Så kom jeg hjem fredag, trænede med holdet, og spillede søndag. Sådan kørte det i seks uger. Det var så efter tredje kamp mod B93, hvor vi spiller 2-2, at vi bliver danske mestre. Jeg kan huske, jeg snuppede et straffespark fra Lynge Jakobsen, da vi spillede mod AaB. Det har jeg forresten aldrig snakket med ham om.
– Jeg følte mig måske ikke så meget som en del af holdet, for det var kun de sidste seks kampe. Men altså, jeg blev modtaget venligt af dem allesammen, der var ikke så meget at spille om der. Allan Hansen sagde til mig, ‘Det er i orden bessefar, vi skal nok hjælpe dig’, så jeg fik lidt over nakken pga. alderen, jeg var jo 37, og Allan var kun 21. Men det gik fint, og vi havde det fint sammen, jeg kendte jo også et par af dem. Jeg er glad for, at jeg fik den oplevelse, ellers havde jeg aldrig vundet noget med OB.
Hvad betød det for dig at blive dansk mester med OB?
– Hvis jeg havde spillet med i hele sæsonen, havde det nok været en større oplevelse, men selvfølgelig var det en stor oplevelse, også fordi, som jeg siger, jeg ellers ikke havde været med til at vinde noget før. Nu kunne jeg sige til mig selv, at jeg havde prøvet at blive dansk mester, og det var jeg glad for. Men som sagt følte jeg mig ikke rigtig som en del af holdet, men det var sjovt at prøve, og det var en god fest bagefter.
Overvejede du at fortsætte efter mesterskabssæsonen?
– Nej, det gjorde jeg ikke. De spurgte mig godt nok, fordi Lars var ung, og for øvrigt kunne de godt have fortsat med ham i 77, de havde sgu vundet alligevel. De førte jo med fem point, og jeg tror, vi vandt med syv, og det var kun to point, man fik for en sejr, så de kunne roligt have fortsat med ham. Det var så mit held, at de ikke gjorde det, og de spurgte mig, om jeg ville tage en sæson mere, men det ville jeg ikke. Jeg blev 38, og hvis jeg skulle fortsætte, skulle jeg også flytte hjem. Man ser nogle målmænd, spille til de er 42, og det kunne jeg også have gjort, men vi var glade for at være i Tyskland, og vi blev der også i 15 år, så der sagde jeg, at det var slut. De var varme på, at jeg skulle komme hjem, men det var for meget at ligge og køre. Det duede ikke.
Kildede det alligevel ikke lidt i maven?
– Jo, det gjorde det. Også fordi de startede med lidt ‘monetos’ i 78, så om ikke andet havde jeg da kunne tjene en masse hjem på kørepenge. Hvis det havde været statens takst, så havde 1200 km. om ugen alligevel været noget. Godt nok havde jeg en god bil. Jeg havde en Mercedes, jeg lå og kørte rundt i dernede, det er det samme som at købe en Skoda herhjemme i dag prismæssigt. Vi gav 70 øre i Danmark for en liter diesel. I Danmark lå skatterne på bilen og ikke på diesel, og i Tyskland var det omvendt, så hver eneste dag kunne du se 20 biler, der holdt oppe i Padborg og tankede. Men vi besluttede os for, at nu var det slut.
Men du har din guldmedalje?
– Det har jeg. Der må jeg sige, at Erik Berthelsen, der desværre også er væk nu, kom ind med krykker på banen, da vi skulle have medaljerne. Vi fik en til at hænge om halsen af DIF, og så fik vi en plakette af DBU. Da jeg havde fået dem, gik jeg hen til Erik, og sagde, ‘Værsgo, det er dig, der har stået langt de fleste kampe’. Han ville ikke have dem begge to, men det skulle han, for jeg havde kun været med i seks kampe, men nej, jeg skulle have den ene. Så sagde jeg, at han skulle tage den, han helst ville have, og så tog han medaljen fra DIF, og jeg fik plaketten fra DBU. Det var jo flot, det må man sige. Men desværre er han væk nu. Det var en god dag, og festen fejlede heller ikke noget. Vi holdt ikke festen samme dag, for det var en søndag aften, og jeg skulle jo på arbejde mandag morgen i Flensborg, men det var lørdagen efter. Vi holdt reception nede i hallen, og der var mange. Selv min gamle far og mor var der. Min far havde jo fulgt mig i mange år. Han kørte mig ind til Odense, da jeg var yngre, og vi havde af og til en diskussion om de mål, der gik ind. Det var sødt af ham, at han ville køre med mig, og han ville også gerne se kampene.
Der er en historie med dig og Lars Høgh på nogle af jeres udebaneture, hvad er det for noget?
– Hans far var jo holdleder, og sommetider fik Lars lov til at komme med i bussen til Randers og Vejle og lign., da han var dreng. Der sad jeg nede på bagsædet sammen med Lars, og læste Anders And for ham, så vi har sådan et specielt forhold til hinanden stadigvæk, også når vi møder hinanden. Dengang stod han også på mål ude i Sanderum, men jeg spekulerede godt nok ikke på, at han en dag skulle have jobbet efter mig der i 77. Man må sige, at han udnyttede det. 817 kampe det var flot.
Da Lars Høgh overtog efter dig i 1978, forestillede du dig så, at han skulle blive den legende han er i klubben i dag, og spille 817 kampe?
– Nej, den tanke havde jeg godt nok ikke. Jeg var godt klar over, at han var en god målmand, det er helt sikkert, men hvis vi så tilbage på min figur dengang, så kunne man sammenligne os. Vi var begge to slanke, jeg vejede jo ikke mere end 70 kilo, det var en god kampvægt, og Lars var jo også slank. Sådan nogle kan jo blive ved længe, det er værre, når du får vægt på, så bliver du langsom. Jeg var godt klar over, han var en god målmand, men at han skulle holde så mange år, det var jeg ikke klar over.
– Han fik otte landskampe, og desværre stod han i skyggen af Schmeichel. I Mexico stod Troels Rasmussen. Lars var med, og det var Ole Qvist også. Troels stod godt i Danmarksturneringen, men når det var internationale kampe, skete der noget, han kunne kraftedeme ikke stå på mål. Efter en kamp eller to derovre satte de Lars på mod Tyskland, og der står han en kanon kamp. De vinder 2-0, hvad de ikke skulle have gjort. Uafgjort så skulle de have mødt Marokko i stedet for Spanien, så havde tyskerne fået Spanien. Sepp Piontek ville jo gerne vinde over tyskerne, og det gjorde de. Lars stod en kanon kamp. Den kamp kan jeg huske, og så den i Madrid. Det var noget af det flotteste, han har lavet. Han har stået mange gode kampe, han var en god målmand.
Du trænede selv Lars Høgh fra 1989 til 1991, hvordan var det? Og hvordan var det at være en del af staben i mesterskabsåret 1989?
– Roald Poulsen ringede til mig, og spurgte, om jeg ville, og det kunne da være meget sjovt. Jeg trænede målmændene i Nr. Aaby samtidig, men Lars var jo nem at have med at gøre, for han kunne jo det hele. Han skulle bare holdes i gang. Der var også en reservemålmand, og han hørte altid efter, når vi trænede, men han glemte det hele, når der var kamp. Det gjorde Lars ikke, han var sikker hele tiden. Det var en fornøjelse.
– Der er bare en ting, jeg er utilfreds med. Den gode Per Bartram blev lige pludselig manager i 89, og da jeg var inde ved ham for at forhandle, jeg skulle lige have lidt, det var sgu nogle småpenge, der sagde han, at jeg skulle huske, at jeg var betragtet lige som alle de andre trænere. Det glemte han lige, da vi blev danske mestre, der var jeg ikke inviteret med til afslutningsfesten, og det har jeg aldrig rigtig tilgivet ham. Jeg har aldrig sagt det til ham, men når han siger, jeg er betragtet som de andre trænere, burde jeg vel også komme med til festen. Det smuttede lige, men jeg er ikke sådan en type, der bærer nag. Jeg er svær at træde over tæerne, for jeg lader ikke folk gøre det, så skide med det.
– Men det var et par gode år, hvor de bl.a. også vinder pokalfinalen mod AaB efter et par kampe. Den blev spillet igen og igen. Der var jeg med til festen om aftenen. Der var Lars god igen, han huggede nogle straffespark.
Er det dig, der har lært ham at hugge de straffespark?
– Nej, det er det ikke. Han siger, han har en eller anden hemmelighed, jeg ved ikke rigtig, hvad det er. Hvis du tænker på en, der sparker et hårdt straffe i dag, fra de rammer bolden, til den passerer stregen, så går der omkring et halvt sekund, og på det halve sekund kan du ikke nå at reagere. Men Lars kunne ligesom kigge dem lidt ud. Jeg gjorde jo det i gamle dage, der var det tit, at der var billeder af de forskellige straffespark i avisen, så jeg skrev ned, ‘Ham der sparker i den side’, og det reddede jeg nogle stykker på, fordi de ikke skiftede side dengang, der sparkede man fast. I dag er de så frække, at de kigger på målmanden, indtil han er gået, men det er også lidt farligt. Et straffespark skal sparkes hårdt og præcist, færdig slut. Spillerne skulle bare vide, hvor stort målmanden synes, målet er, når han står derinde. Så ville de ikke være så bange for at sparke.
Når man ser dig og Lars Høgh, er det tydeligt at se, at i har samme bevægelsesmønster inde i målet. Ser du også det?
– Det kan da godt være. Lars har før sagt til mig, at jeg var hans idol, da han var knægt, og det kan da godt være, at han har luret lidt på mig. Det har jeg aldrig spekuleret på. Det kan da godt være, at der er noget om det. Vi har begge to været rolige, det var også en af de ting, de skrev om mig i avisen, da jeg afløste ham sprællemanden fra KB. Det kan godt være, men jeg har aldrig selv tænkt over det. Den anden dag så jeg et klip, mit barnebarn havde fundet fra vores kamp mod Rusland, og der var det også sådan stille og roligt, så det kan sgu godt være. Det kan da godt være, Lars har taget noget til sig. Lars havde det der med, at når han kom ud, så blev han stående. Ikke noget med at kaste sig vildt. Jeg har fundet ud af, at hvis der er en klumpspil situation, hvor en spiller pludselig er fri, så kan da betale sig for målmanden at blive stående i otte af ti tilfælde. Mange gange kaster man sig ned, og så kommer den sgu lige der, hvor man stod. Lars blev stående, og han kunne lure den.
– Han havde jo den der alder, hvor han så op til de spillere, og det kan da godt være, han har prøvet at efterligne lidt, det er da muligt. Han har så måske bare gjort det bedre, for han var virkelig stærk. Det må jeg spørge ham om engang.
Hvordan følger du så OB i dag?
– Så vidt muligt jeg kan, tager jeg da på stadion, og ser dem. Jeg har endelig fået et kort, så jeg kan komme ind. For 2-3 år siden skulle vi jo betale for at komme ind og se OB, og det gad jeg altså ikke. For to år siden fik vi et kort, os der har spillet 100 kampe. Vi kan så gå bagom op på tribunen, vi kan ikke komme gennem loungen. Dem der er i Oldboys-bestyrelsen, har et Guldkort, hvor de kan komme op og spise med de fine, og så sagde Peter Nielsen fra Oldboys-bestyrelsen, ‘Det kan ikke være rigtigt, at Mogens ikke kan se fodbold gratis’, og så vekslede han sit Guldkort til to Sølvkort. Det betyder, at man så kan gå ind i kælderen, og du kan komme og drikke alle de bajere, du vil, og han var sgu ligeglad med det spisning, så han gav mig et kort. Det synes jeg, er flot. Jeg kan tage ud og se fodbold og få et glas vin, og det er jeg som regel også.
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